Winning With Shopify
The one stop Shopify Podcast. Weekly information for people looking to start, grow and accelerate and Win with their Shopify store without being too techy.
Your host Nick Trueman has over 15 years experience and started hosting this Shopify Podcast in 2020. Nick's been in the digital arena for a long time, loves Shopify and will be sharing his knowledge and interviewing experts from Shopify app creators, business gurus and marketing experts. It's not hard if you have the right advice to build a successful online shop so you can lay back, leave the rat race and create a lifestyle you love! No fluff and no smoke and mirrors, just the real actionable advice that will have you WINNING WITH SHOPIFY. The only Shopify Podcast you need to subscribe to!
Winning With Shopify
How to get to page 1 of Google for FREE traffic with Jason Berkowitz
Welcome to the winning with shopify podcast, the podcast that will teach you to take your shopify store and turn it into an automated sales machine with the latest marketing emails, sales and social media advice, strategies, and tips from experts without the fluff. Your host, Caroline Balinski, the founder of just asked Parker Dot com, the only small marketing task agency for shopify owners with over 10 years experience in marketing, manufacturing, design, and ecommerce. She shares her knowledge and interviews the experts to help you in your journey to success. Now, here's your host, Caroline Berlinski,
Speaker 2:however one. Thank you for joining me again on this podcast. It's so great to have you here. I'm really excited today. This is something I'm asked about all the time by people who listened to the podcast and my clients. I have Jason on the line today. He is here on the podcast telling us everything about Seo. So I came across Jason because he's doing such an amazing job out there. He's since 2009, which is a very long time when it comes to online marketing stuff. Since 2009, Jason has been an active leader in the New York City digital marketing community, founded two successful for ones called break the web, which I love that name. It's fantastic, and the other one is called Seo Services New York, which is really good because he talks about seo and that name is fantastic just for that reason. So since the inception, Jason has managed marketing campaigns for some of the most significant brands in the world and carries out a unique philosophy which we're going to learn more about today when it comes to campaign success. And in his spare time, Jason can be found falling from the sky as an amateur sky diver. So today we're going to talk to Jason About Seo. Like I said, we're going to ask him one of the most burning questions that everyone wants to know and that is how does seo work for shopify stores and how to do it for shopify stores. I'm going to ask Jason everything that you need to know about Seo and by the end of this podcast you'll be able to be fixing and updating your seo on your own products. So let's get started. Let's meet Jason. Let's walk to the show. So Jason. Hi, welcome. Thank you so much for joining me today.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much for having me. Carolina, it's a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 2:Wonderful. So let's get straight into it. I want you to introduce yourself and then we're going to get straight into the nitty gritty of ACR. So tell everyone a little bit more about yourself.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. We're going to talk all about skydiving, right? Not Seo. So I'm again, 2009 is when I started as a freelancer and I started as a freelancer because I had my own business locally here in New York City. It was a personal training company that was failing to bring in new clients and new prospects or leads, so to speak, for our business. And I was looking for new ways to market online, get my business out there and uh, quite the rabbit hole. I went down and I learned about the acronym Seo or search engine optimization. Unfortunately at that time I didn't have much of a budget to kind of invest in a testing or to invest in all these different seo courses. So the biggest thing for me was uh, to network and I networked with over the time the, some of the greatest minds in the seo industry and a piggybacked off them off right now. I'm a lot of free workout plans and free diet plans for them and their family. And then over time I was able to collect my own data about Seo, our personal training website. Got really good success online and which I eventually sold the company. But I ended up having a paradigm shift of sorts. And my passion for fitness kind of transferred into a passion for digital marketing and solving that challenge of creating awareness and positioning online and freelancing business kind of took off with our first theater website or seo services. New York.org, which was what we call an emd or an exact match domain. Which means that the main search term we wanted to target on Google was simply the domain name, and over the course of six months we successfully ranked that website and a was advertising primarily as a freelancer and as my name became more prominent in the New York City, was able to grow the team with account managers, sales managers, execution teams, and to where we are now, which is an actual inbound marketing, a digital marketing agency called to break the web and that's simply because seo services, New York sucks that branding.
Speaker 2:Yes, but it might suck for branding, but it definitely works when it comes to Seo reasons, which is interesting
Speaker 3:and it gets the point across. What do you do? We provide seo services in New York.
Speaker 2:Exactly. So about that, straight off. The first question I want to ask you is when it comes to exact name matches, how important is that for an ecommerce store?
Speaker 3:It works very well from an seo standpoint and there's been a lot of discussions and the stl community about whether it's still works, not. My personal belief is that it still works very, very well, but at the end of the day, I believe having a brand and an entity that's away from your main keyword is probably more important. If you can get a lot more diverse with their catalog of products, you can get a lot more diverse in your foods future offerings. Um, plus if you're, again, if your business name has a specific search term and my now ring off the time just as well as a catchy brand name so to speak.
Speaker 2:Interesting. So the next thing I want to ask you is automatic seo is built into shopify stores. So how important is seo in general for shopify stores, if it's already there, on the product pages in each page that people set up on there?
Speaker 3:Well, there's many different, um, parts moving parts within SCO, uh, and it's most broadest terms. We have a two parts on page seo and off page seo. Onpage seo is what's really built into shopify with the options to change the titles, met information at some schema markup of sorts. And that's all considered onpage seo, changing the url structure. And the content itself, those are all considered everything takes place on your website and then the other 50 percent of an Seo campaign is what we call off page Seo, not sending trust signals to your website, a primarily through the biggest tactic which is acquiring backlinks, which is when one website has that clickable text which goes to your website and that's how Google sees trust being passed from one website to another end. Essentially Google wants to rank websites which are deemed authoritative and that's how authority is transferred or as we call a seo juice is being transferred from one website to another and they kind of work hand in hand and 50 slash 50 and utilizing shopify settings for on page seo is a very big portion of the entire Seo strategy. Making sure that your content is 100 percent relevant with the search term. You're answering that question, making sure your titles and your keywords and your url is just look really good national and kind of display what that page is about. So it's definitely very, very important in 2018
Speaker 2:and is that. It's definitely still important, but I've foreign ecommerce store, if you're selling a pair of jeans or if you're selling a tee shirts, how many people are actually using google when it comes to looking for that sort of thing. How important is seo when it comes to selling products?
Speaker 3:Probably very important. You know, there's many different, many different variables with a or vectors with digital marketing and Seo is one of the many different verticals and she is great because essentially it's free organic traffic once you put in the work and once you have those rankings, it's a lot less work to maintain them, but you're not paying per click. And if you find a target that can definitely warrants realist results and you're not going against all the conglomerate ecommerce stores that are both online and local, uh, they're all definitely aware of them. It can be a game changer for any business or any shopify store in terms of virtually being unknown to becoming a digital brand authority in a way.
Speaker 2:So if you're selling say Nike sneakers or added, probably trying to see are the web address, sneakers is probably not going to work very well for the startup.
Speaker 3:Yeah. One of the big things that we tend to notice when we're speaking with a prospective client for our agency is one of the first things we do is try to manage the expectations of what's realistic and what's not. And like Nike and Adidas type a search queries are probably one of the most heavily spam search terms on the web. It's definitely something I would not go for just because you might spend a year or two. We're trying to optimize your entire website for one specific keyword and it probably really won't warrant great results. Especially when you mentioned big brands. Google will give weight to those brand properties, so obviously the Nike Dot Com store for example, and then all the other big warehouses that just sell Nike brands, which are huge conglomerates which have huge authority behind them, which people are naturally linking to and kind of their seo is kind of automated in a way just because they're so huge. People are naturally. I'm sending them trust signals, so again, it comes down to finding those realistic targets. What's going to actually warrant a results to bring in new traffic to your website
Speaker 2:and what does being on the first page of Google actually mean these days. Because I remember when I started in Seo is more than 10 years ago, it was a very, very different thing. It was just you're on the first page of Google and you're on the first page everywhere in the world. Whereas now I know it's very different. So what does that mean? Getting to that first page?
Speaker 3:Well, I can tell you what it means being on page two, page two, we actually have a joke. Whereas the best place to hide a dead body on page two of Google, it's an old joke. You may have heard it before and, and I'm, I'm Corny with my dad jokes, but um, it really is, you know, most people aren't going past the first page. We do know, and Google even admits it with their own data that most people are skipping the ads. That's number one. And then most people aren't going past the first page and that's simply because the results on page one are usually really good results and that's Google's goal is provide answers, really good valuable, trustworthy answers to people's questions or search queries and Google's got really good at that and it's very likely that any search user will find the answer they're looking for. And again asked her could be a product or a symptom for a medical condition, whatever it is. Usually on page one of Google, it's very rare that most people will go to page two. So page one absolute game changer and the closer you are to the top of page one and you're significantly increasing your chances of getting that click. So that click through rate is usually around 33 percent. Going to the number one listing on the entire page.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's pretty amazing. But what does it mean? Let's say you're selling jeans around the world and you get to page one for genes and you can see it there. You live in London and you can see it on page one. Can everyone else around the world see that one as well or it depends on other things as well?
Speaker 3:I would say it probably depends on the country. Most countries have their own a google database. Now. There are also ones that search queries or results that are universal can attest to exactly what it is. Are you primarily focused on google.com and probably Google that Koda UK as majority, but it definitely will increase your chances, especially if you ship to a specific location. If you have websites, also sister websites that are properly set up for a specific geographical location, then you kind of have a worldwide domination and obviously making sure that those websites are connected properly with a specific role tags and it's called lane tags to kind of separate the specific languages by countries. It's deep coding stuff. I think that you could find any resourceful information about it on the web. Then you can really get a worldwide domination, so to speak, with sister websites for each country having a top level domain for that specific country.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. How does the. You just mentioned it before. No one's really looking at the ads on Google it. There's a few different things going on on Google, so you, but the Google shopping listings, you've got the business listings, you've got the Google ads, and then you've got the organic. Can you sort of give us a run through of how those all relate to seo and being on that page of Google I guess?
Speaker 3:Well, we all know that Google is making their money from ads so they are consistently changing the ad visibility and the way they look and are designed to kind of blend in with the organic listings because they know that people are skipping them, but of course their goal is to increase revenue, so even now regular Google ad words as a you'll see right at the top kind of in a way look like the organic search results, but legally they have to say adds a with the product listing ads. The way everything's changing. Again, organic is still essentially free traffic, but also with paid advertising, especially with ecommerce was definitely a lot of good opportunities there. With the business listings itself or the Google maps listings that you'll see on page one, it's very rare you'll see that for product specific type of search queries, unless there's a way to get these types of products from a local business, usually there'll be more, they'll kind of be missing that. But um, was opportunities from an ecommerce standpoint all around the board on page one.
Speaker 2:Okay. Fantastic. Another question. So I went through on my facebook group and out to my email list and I asked people what they wanted to know about Seo, what were their questions? So I'm just reading out some of the questions I've gotten from them. And then some are just ones that I know that people should be asking you and they don't realize they should be asking. So one of the other questions I have here is what is this whole penguin and panda thing with Google that they keep referring to these different penguin and panda things that we hear about, but some people don't understand what that means.
Speaker 3:So these are nicknames sort of speak for algorithmic filters that Google has released over the years now. Penguin was an update that was first released in around 2012, which their filter, their algorithmic filter, primarily targeted spammy backlinks, low quality backlinks coming from non-relevant websites, going to yours in huge abundance that doesn't make sense and kind of doesn't mimic the natural way of website would gain backlinks. Pans on the other hand, came out about a year or two earlier than that and that focuses on thin content within the website itself. So you can say that panda focuses on onpage seo while penguin focuses on off page seo. And again, panda filters, you know, it even goes broader than specifically within your website if you're a straight out copying somebody's website and have duplicate content that could trigger a panda update. Uh, but yeah, I would say that the easiest way to remember it is thinking of a off-page versus onpage Seo. So penguin be off page seo and panda would be on page Seo.
Speaker 2:Okay. So on that point that you just mentioned when you said that at Google notices if your website's been copied, I've had some people, and I was just talking to someone about this because we were talking about images being copied on whether you should watermark your images. So this is another thing with ecommerce stores. So people are scared that their whole website's going to be ripped off. In that case, if someone does copy on your website, does Google and see your website is a bad one or the other one or just both of them.
Speaker 3:Way To know exactly. The best practice is really to make sure that Google crawls your website first if they get your data first. It's clear then that you came out first, but to avoid this, but we'd like to do is file the MCA complaints where, um, it's kind of like a seasoned assist of sorts. And if they don't remember the content then I can, will physically struck down there, virtually shut down their website. And, um, that's something you can file again, proving that you're the owner of the photos, the images, the content itself, the products, the website, the brand name, etc. But again, the best practice we'll try to be to hope that google finds your content first. Now that can Be done by increasing the amount of times you're publishing on your website. That means that google will frequently visit your website more, which is good. You can also submit your website every time you come out with a new piece of content or new page through google search console and it's very easy to do from there. Um, so if that is a concern, a big concern, um, then I would definitely go that route. We don't typically like to worry about duplicate content because I think google has gotten a little bit smarter and understand that low quality people do steal content and we have yet to really see those issues as much arising. So it's not really as common to get duplicate content penalties.
Speaker 2:No, that's what I try to tell people. Don't be so worried about that because you know, there's so many other things you have to worry about and worrying about someone ripping on appeal website is not a big deal, so it's good to hear it from you as well.
Speaker 3:And if they do, you just file it and if it does bug you and doesn't know you, especially if they're using it in marketing material than a dmc has very good that you can file tmca complainant, um, over the course of a couple of weeks we'll probably get taken down.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. So people can just Google that and work that out themselves. We won't get into that right now. The next question I have is how long does it take to see results? I just had an email come in from someone just to moments before we got on this call and they said, oh, I've been told that I should be my website and spending all this money on seo. And I had a look at the person's website and there's a million other things wrong. So I said to her, it's going to take you time. She was selling, I'm branded something like we were just talking about certain brands and how long does it take to get results with your seo and what sort of results have you seen when it comes to a comments,
Speaker 3:the timeframe of getting seo results, seo
Speaker 4:as a strategy overall is a patience game. It sucks.[inaudible] is not the same as it used to be back in the day, used to be able to see significant results in less than a month. Now, seo is more of a long term strategy and again, the results that come from it really play into a longterm plan just because essentially it's free traffic and you're not actively spending money to get that traffic. We usually say, um, again, this is making sure that all other areas of the website are really up to par. Again, if there's a lot of issues on the website, I will definitely hinder the results. But again, if you're canceling out every single possible technical issue on page seo issue a loading speed issue, a blocked resources issue on your website and you engage in an off page seo campaign, which is usually the longterm execution process, you can technically see results if it's really in a noncompetitive space in as little as four to six weeks. But, uh, usually it's better to manage expectations a little bit and kind of see it as a longterm results. And again, as long as you're doing everything perfectly, you can see great results within a few months.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. And so the sort of products that you recommend will get faster results than other products. I'm more of a handmade sort of products that are very unique. I going to get faster results. Is that what I'm understanding from what you're saying?
Speaker 4:I think it really comes down to the competition. And this is all research during the strategy development and target research phase. Again, when you start an seo campaign, you have to do a research opportunities. What might be a good target for this specific page or one might be a good target? For our highest revenue generating product, and if you look at that research in reverse to reverse engineer their competition and you see that there's really not much power going to, these websites don't really have much backlinks going to them. Their content is kind of crappy. Then you definitely have a really good chance to provide a better user experience, get more back things, get more trust signals through website that will typically warrants much faster results as opposed to target stuff. A liTtle bit more competitive. As an example we did was any commerce clothing store that we just, we're in the early stages of working with and right now we're focused primarily on building the foundation through pr, foundational lengths, making sure the on seo is perfect and they're tarGeting a pretty competitive space. They're also aware that, um, it's very likely they won't see results. We gave them estimate of 14 to 16 months, which is really long. But also it's realistic in terms of what they can expect. So again, making sure everything is done right. If you are in a noncompetitive space and their main competitors on page one of google really don't have their sel par, then you can get really quick results and the opposite would be for really heavily competition type keywords. Yeah, so in its simplest form as a, I guess a quick recap is that if you are in a noncompetitive space and you found out that I helped do the research or the non competitive keywords, you will typically get asked or results on. The opposite would be if you go into really competitive markets or the results might take a little bit more time and that's simply because trust be built overnight and seo being the longterm solution that it is. Golden google takes your website and back links that are going to your website and do various algorithmic filters and tests, so to speak. We call it the google mousetrap and you might see fluctuations that result and that's really google determining whether the incoming trust signals are real or if they're spam and for that reason, again, usually a more competitive space as things may take a little longer. we gave an estimate for a very competitive industry with an ecommerce client of ours, a 14 to 16 months, and um, that's, that's pretty conservative, so to speak, just because they're really competitive and we're building that foundation first, whereas a lot of their own content marketing opportunities that we've created for them, they're going to be able to target low hanging fruit initially and get initial traffic for the lower hanging fruit. Just this is not as competitive.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think what people need to understand is that it's a longterm strategy, but if you're planning on being in this market for a while and you're planning on running a stall for awhile, or if you're planning on selling your business, then you need to be doing seo.
Speaker 4:Absolutely. Every, every single marketing team or a company should have a ceo and their overall strategy. It's one of the many different marketing verticals and it warrants amazing results.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Fantastic. So you just mentioned one of the tools that you working with that you're working with for that 14 month period. And I know what you mean because I think people hearing that thinking, oh my god, that's so long, but that's just sort of a general idea, isn't it? And some of the keywords are going to come up in a few months and then some of them are going to take longer. So you're sort of averaging it and you're giving them. You're not trying to hide in that expectation. Yeah,
Speaker 4:absolutely. In that campaign specifically set up into two different, I would say search terms. We have the initial low hanging fruit to start and we have the highly competitive, a high revenue generating search terms. Now the low hanging fruit will warrant faster results simply because it's not as competitive. We have better seo value to provide to these pages and these are content pages. So we're doing content marketing with them. We have a better seo value to provide to google so they can see it and that will help get some initial traffic to the website and start them at the top of the buyer's funnel and then as the website and actually gains more authority over the course of 14 months. Uh, we believe with our projections that we can start hitting a lot more competitive targets, ones that will really be a game changer for them and their business and bringing a lot more revenue to the store.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. I love the way you talk about low hanging fruit first because I think that most seo people out there are sort of in it for the long term. They only think long time and as a business owner, and I've owned businesses, I've had ecommerce stores. That sounds really scary from that point of going what you just thinking 12 months from now and spending all this money for 12 months out, but you're talking about, okay, we're talking about 12 months and we're talking about what we can do now as well. So I think that's what I really like about your way of thinking and that's what we said in the intro, that you put a few different philosophies from average seo person because you can look at that are low hanging fruit first, which brings in some money. And then you talk about long term strategy as well.
Speaker 4:The goal with seo is to get traffic from organic search, if you need immediate traffic to your website, especially to start generating revenue and start creating that content that will target those low hanging fruits, make sure you set up a proper funnel to take them through the buyer's journey from the top of the funnel to maybe if they're just lookinG for an answer to a question all the way to the bottom of the funnel, which is the add to cart button, so to speak, or even the checkout overall. I'm definitely getting that initial traffic which could bring in initial sales. It can help move the needle internally and also with your marketing efforts.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. So I had a question from one of the people on my email list and they were asking how do you see your product that has many different color variations, so you only have a certain amount of words that you can put in on your on page seo for your description. So let's say you put 10 different color variations. Some of them are, in their case, different prints and different colors. How do you see for that one product, but many different variations?
Speaker 4:Absolutely. I will apologize because this may get a little bit technical, so anything I'm about to say you can google research yourself as well. So first off, the best example of this that we'd like to talk about is amazon. Amazon uses proper, what we call a faceted navigation. What that means is we used to like to sort of filter whether it's a color, a size, a condition or whatever it is that the url structure might change, but in the coating and a source code of that page, there's something called a canonical and that still is the initial main product page. Does that make a little sensitive? Clinical is basically telling them the google search resUlts, the real url of a specific webpage and when you change these different filters, again, color, size, shape a pattern. It might change the url structure, but when google visits that page, they won't index in their system that long. A long url structure with pressure marks and and all these different things. They'll see that original product page and the best example of that again, is amazon. Go to amazon performance search, go to a product, play around with the different variables on that page, and you'll see that the url changes significantly, but if you right click and you view the page source and you type in a command f or control f and type in canonical, you will see that the canonicals, the original product description without any of those filters. So we call that faceted navigation.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. So do you know of any apps for shopify and the shopify apps that you recommend that people use when it comes to seo?
Speaker 4:I'm essentially, I'm very basic when it comes to that, as long as you can properly, um, add an metta information, enhance the page titles, update the products with schema schema, markup about the products, the price, the reviews, et cetera. That's the best thing. I don't have a specific application in mind, but as long as you can do that and you can take the website or run it through google structured data testing and come back with no problems, no issues, there's no duplIcate metadata. There's no duplicate titles within that source code itself. Then you're golden.
Speaker 2:So where do they do that test?
Speaker 4:Uh, it's, you can just google google structured data testing tool and that's meant for the schema markup testing to ensure that your page has proper schema markup.
Speaker 2:Okay, fantastic. I'll put the notes in the show notes on the website on just as pocket.com/podcast. I'm actually going to put the link there so people don't have to go and google it. I'll put that link in the show notes for everyone because I'm sure a lot of people now saying, okay, I need to test this. I need to find out if it Works. So that's fine. I'll put it in there for everyone and it's a really long url and I'm not going to start saying no, no, no, that's fine. They can just click that link and find it themselves. So my next question is, what are the top things that every store owner needs to do immediately today? So they're listening to this saying, okay, for everything that you're saying, jason, this makes sense and it sounds like I need to take action. What are the top things that people should be taking action on immediately?
Speaker 4:Yeah. I think one of the big things, if you do have products that allow you to add different filters, like I mentioned before, faceted navigation is something that's severely, uh, underlooked in the ecommerce space. It's super important. Google will end, if it's not done correctly, googleable ended up, uh, indexing multiple copies of your page leading to onsite duplicate content. It's not a very good user experience. It'll kind of cog up the google database with a bunch of thousands of pages of useless content on your websIte and it's not very good. So faceted navigation is definitely one of the most important things as well as, um, I know that these are settinGs within shopify having unique meta information, unique titles for every single page on your website, and it might sound really time consuming. So maybe spread it out over the course of a few months, but a google search console, which is a tool that any website owner can see how google's viewing your website, they will tell you specifically if you have a toolkit titles on your website, duplicate meta descriptions, and if google is giving you those warnings usually means that they don't like it. So I have unique content, unique meta information. You need titles, unique urls for every single page on your website. and that's probably also with fastenal navigation. One of the biggest issues we see when we do internal audits.
Speaker 2:Okay, fantastic. Once again, I'm going to put that in the show notes, the links for that. So the google search console is by people should be going to make sure that their website is actually up to scratch in google's eyes. And I'll again, I'll put that all in the show notes. Everyone I like you said, there's a lot of places people have to go and find the stuff. Bought eighties had to explain because a lot of people listening to this podcast or running while driving. So it's basically for people.
Speaker 4:Absolutely. And if there's any questions in regards to google search console does a lot of free information on the web, you know, go down a rabbit hole of sorts and search how to use google's first console. I have never done it, but I know that I can imagine there's a
Speaker 3:lot of youtube videos on it and somebody can give you a nice quick run through of it.
Speaker 2:Sure. Fantastic. So we've spoken about onsite, onsite or on page seo. What are some things that people can do about that? Off page seo? Can they take action themselves? You mentioned, you know, there's backlinks and things like that involved. What can people do that maybe they've, they can tap into what they're already doing to make sure that they're off page seo. It get started.
Speaker 3:Uh, it's most broadest term is outreach. There's nothing better than old school outreach reaching out to, if you ever product reaching out to influencers are reaching out to bloggers, to editors. And one of the ways again is giving out your product for review on their website. and I'm assuming that your product isn't an awesome product and or just say, hey, can I be a contributor on your blog saying we write great content about this topic, would love to be a guest writer, so to speak, on your website and I can provide amazing content that I believe your readers will enjoy. And within that content self of course, uh, to do a non spammy shameless plug or whatever on your website, I'm in its simplest form, you can at least try to get a link in the author bio, usually at the bottom of that blog post. But that's an easy, straightforward way to get backlinks is playing an old outreach and it does take work that is time consuming. But, uh, one of our, one of our clientS, when they do that for their internal team, we do a lot of consulting there. That's where they really enjoy, is seeing those tangible results coming in the form of pr type backlinks.
Speaker 2:So you did mention just then to give out products for free. But when you say that, you mean to blow it, not just to family or friends. People that have websites that can create a link for you back to your website.
Speaker 3:Yeah, friends of family is good, especially in the early stages of our product. Get feedback for a but with seo, your goal, you're giving pretty much a value proposition in exchange for a backlink and that's the big one, is reaching out to influencers, a lot of the influencer networks to get in touch or reach out to your favorite instagram person that's in your industry or twitter person and say, hey, how can we work together? We have this specific product. I'd love to send it to you, you know, and its simplest form.
Speaker 2:Fantastic. Well on that note, while everyone's listening, I actually have the influence and marketing summit. If anyone wants to know more about it, the show notes for your page, jason, on just as pocket.com. Actually, we'll have a link there that people can sign up for that influencer marketing summit, which is exactly what you're saying. FiNd the influences, get them to try new products and then that's going to create the backlinks for you to help you with your seo.
Speaker 3:And again, not only backlinks, but you're probably also get traffic if they ever pubic reach, so you're kind of killing two birds with one stone and that's why we call it pr style back lInks because it's kind of a pr campaign of sorts as well. And from an seo standpoint, the big driver for seo is that back link and again from a pr standpoint, you're getting that traffic, that interest and the target buyer persona so to speak.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Fantastic. And so what I want ask you now, because I think that you've given people a lot of food for thought, thinking about how they can actually go away and start to think about that on page and off page seo, but I know a lot of people that will be sitting there feeling completely overwhelmed thinking, I still don't understand and I don't want to go find all the youtube videos. I Don't want to try to wait this out myself. You did mention to me that you do have a virtual three hour workshop. Can you tell us a little bit more about that?
Speaker 3:Yeah. It's actually something we've been doing a lot more ecommerce clients and it's simply consulting or advisement where we teach their internal marketing team how to execute proper seo strategy all the way from the beginning and it's about three hours spread over the course of three weeks just to make things easy to understand. All these calls are recorded, but the first call is usually strategy development and research, how to find low hanging fruit, how to find more competitive spaces, how to create an overall content marketing strategy or our product target strategy to get those seo rankings and reverse engineering the competition. Learning more about sco overall. Second session usually consists of everything related to onpage seo that's a little bit more technical. Could have been to a lot of technical aspects of ecommerce on page seo and then again a more fun is the off page seo, giving you our systems and our frameworks that we do internally to scale link building scale outreach so you can go from literally having no backlinks to a. If you're really working hard at it, 50 and in one or two months.
Speaker 2:Fantastic, and I'll just let everyone know, knowing the amount of years I've been in this industry and doing seo myself, but also just across marketing in general, what everyone needs to understand is that if you do not have those right keywords, if you don't know the actual words that people are searching for you for, you're going to be wasting a whole at a time. So these sort of black sharpies where jason, your laying those foundational areas where people need to understand that because people can go out there and start trying to build links or they can go out and try to find influences for certain keywords, but they might be running up a whole lot of, you know, giving out free product. They might be wasting time trying to get keywords. I'm ranking just completely wrong keywords and I'm not going to help them anyway.
Speaker 3:One hundred percent, you know, just as your example you said earlier, we're making for jeans, uh, assertion that probably gets a couple of million searches per month is not a good target. And that's where you say, okay, most people will say, okay, we want to rank for jeans, has a couple of million, I will try to do it ourselves, or we'll hire an seo company. It also comes down to that reverse engineering a page, one results, seeing what's there, how do you reverse engineer them to see what might be a realistic opportunity that it's worth it to spend your time, your money on?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Fantastic. So jason, thank you so much. Can you just tell everyone again how they can find out more about working with you or finding out about that virtual workshop that you have or maybe you can. I'm just putting them in the right direction. If they need some help. So where can they get hold of you?
Speaker 3:Absolutely. You can email me@atbreaktheweb.org.
Speaker 2:I can be found of course at[inaudible] dot org and seo services, new york.org. Fantastic. Well jason, thank you so much for being here. I know that everyone's now going, wow, okay. I'm going to go off and run away and check on my seo. So thank you so much for helping us out and giving us that information and I hope to have you back on here at some stage telling us more about. I want to get you on here about that pr stuff that you're talking about, which I think is very interesting for people as well. So thank you again, jason for being here and thank you everyone for listening today and I look forward to having you back on the next episode. Thank you.
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